Put your thinking caps on for this one [update]

"Chariotoflove" (chariotoflove)
02/11/2020 at 15:44 • Filed to: Oppo roadside assistance

UPDATE: Kia service says bad battery. They’re charging me 20%+labor to install. They also want to do fuel injector service and coolant service they say both are regular maintenance items I’m at 35k miles

Original post: Whenever my wife’s Sedona is left without starting for more than a day, the battery goes dead, as in nothing will click, beep, or glimmer. I have to charge it up or jump it, and then all is good, as long as I don’t let it sit for two days.

I’ve taken it into the dealer, but they can’t find anything wrong. Of course, by the time they see it, the battery is charged, because I charged it to get it there. I know there is a leak somewhere in the electrical system, but I don’t have any idea how to chase it down. Thoughts?

DISCUSSION (75)

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:22

You’re certain it’s a healthy battery, right?

My X-type is too a real Jaguar > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:25

I had a battery with a bad cell that acted like that.

ttyymmnn > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:26

Brake light switch is malfunctioning, leaving the brake lights on all night? I speak from experience on this one

Chariotoflove > ttyymmnn
02/11/2020 at 13:27

Nah, checked that. Good idea though.

Aremmes > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:28

Get a multitester if you don’t have one, pull out all of the fuses, put the multitester in line between the positive terminal and lead, and start putting them back one at a time while watching the current draw. This will give you an idea of which device(s) has the largest draw.

Or, like Rusty pointed out, maybe you have a bad battery.

Chariotoflove > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
02/11/2020 at 13:28

No. They tell me it is as far as they can tell, but I will lobby for a new one.

Chariotoflove > My X-type is too a real Jaguar
02/11/2020 at 13:29

Would there be a way to check for that?

Chariotoflove > Aremmes
02/11/2020 at 13:30

Okay.

And yeah, maybe.

Thomas Donohue > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:31

Did the dealer put a load on the battery and test it? Sounds like a dead battery that won’t hold much of a charge, or if it’s new then you’ve got a pretty heavy drain on it.

If there’s a parasitic drain, the only way to really determine the cause is an inline ammeter, then start pulling fuses to see where the the drain is.

Lastly , possible alternator issues.

Good luck!

Chuckles > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:36

If you can spare it, drop it off at the dealer and have them look at it a few days later. Maybe take it in on a Saturday night and call them Monday morning. That way it’ll be dead when they see it.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:36

Do the cigarette lighters work to draw power when the car’s off? If so, is there anything left in the car that would be pulling power all night?

Chariotoflove > Thomas Donohue
02/11/2020 at 13:37

Those are good ideas, and I’m going to talk about them with the service dept. Thanks for the luck. I’ll need it.

Chariotoflove > Chuckles
02/11/2020 at 13:38

Hey, that’s a good idea. I’ll fly that by my wife.

Chariotoflove > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
02/11/2020 at 13:40

No. I know that from our cooler that plugs into the socket and won’t run when the car isn’t on.

We’ve gone over it a couple of times now to see if there is anything we left on that could be drawing power, starting with the dome lights, of course. Nothing so far.

My X-type is too a real Jaguar > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:42

A place like auto zone or advance can with the battery in the car.

TorqueToYield > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:45

New battery time.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:45

The last entry here may be your culprit.

https://www.kia-forums.com/threads/battery-dead-repeatedly.280593/

Chuckles > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:48

It’s more time intensive than some of the other recommendations, but it also only requires you to drive it there instead of working on it.

Chuckles > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 13:52

Just make sure that the technician understands the situation. Otherwise you'll get a call from a tech on monday morning that says "it's all fixed and ready! It just needed a jumpstart!"

Chariotoflove > TorqueToYield
02/11/2020 at 13:59

I’m thinking so. If the problem remains after that, it’s the car.

Chariotoflove > Chuckles
02/11/2020 at 14:01

That’s the problem anyway so far. They keep sayin they don’t find anything wrong with the battery, so they can’t replace it under warranty.

Tekamul > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 14:02

I agree with a lot of other voices here. From personal experience, it sounds like a bad battery that has a cell that’s dead and draining the rest.

But I can’t imagine the dealer didn’t load test it. I'd still have it done, just to be sure. Most parts stores do that for free.

Chariotoflove > Tekamul
02/11/2020 at 14:08

They keep saying they can’t find anything wrong with the battery, but I’ve never been there to witness what they’re doing to say that. My logic is that there’s a problem in the battery, in which case they should replace the battery under warranty, or the battery is fine and there’s a parasitic leak, which they should find and repair under warranty.

I may just spring for a new battery if they won’t do anything. But then if the problem recurs, I will hold the service manager’s feet to the fire.

Chuckles > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 14:11

If you don't want to leave the car there, could you just take the battery out and take it to them after it dies again?

Chariotoflove > Chuckles
02/11/2020 at 14:12

Possibly. Not sure that’s more convenient though.

BigBlock440 > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 14:12

1st, sounds like a dead battery.

2nd, my BIL had a similar problem. You could see the voltage dropping with a multimeter and the car turned off . I used a FLIR camera to find the circuit that was still throwing off heat, pulled the fuse, and no more drain. As far as I could tell, it was just the cigarette lighter. Of course it needed a new battery anyway, since a few years of that it was no good anymore. I didn’t bother tracing it further since it had a separate 12v outlet that was on a different circuit and he didn’t need it.

Chuckles > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 14:14

It is in that you wouldn't have to leave the car there for days. Just drive it as per usual until it dies, pop the battery out and take it there (assuming you have another vehicle to transport it).

facw > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 14:15

Do you have AAA? Next time it dies, call them and have them test it before/after jumping. If it shows as needing replacement you can then take that info to the dealer. If you don’t have AAA, you can get it tested at a parts store, but seems better to start with it dead.

Chariotoflove > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
02/11/2020 at 14:20

That’s informative, thanks.

I think I’m going to take it to them and ask them to both check the cells in the battery and to go through the circuits in the car to see if there is a drain. I wouldn’t mind getting a new battery, even if all out of my own pocket, but not if I end up with the same problem. That would be unacceptable.

Chariotoflove > Chuckles
02/11/2020 at 14:21

Well yeah, but then I have an unusable car in my driveway instead of theirs. :) This would be better if I had a spare battery.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 14:53

What year? And starter or stereo added?

What happens if you charge it, disconnect and test in the morning?

Chariotoflove > gmporschenut also a fan of hondas
02/11/2020 at 15:38

2015. Dealer installed remote start. Don’t know. We always got it started and then used it. Alternator took over from there.

benjrblant > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 15:48

Fuel injector service at 35k miles? Seems... soon.

ttyymmnn > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 15:49

By 20% do you mean 20% the cost of a new battery?

HammerheadFistpunch > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 15:50

Coolant? sure. Fuel injector? Naw. Thats just a bottle of techron.

Chariotoflove > ttyymmnn
02/11/2020 at 15:50

Yes

Chariotoflove > benjrblant
02/11/2020 at 15:50

Do I tell them no?

ttyymmnn > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 15:51

Original to the car, and if so, how old?

Chariotoflove > HammerheadFistpunch
02/11/2020 at 15:52

So not worth $145? Do I tell them no? I mean, it’s always tough to override the service recommendations when you don’t know yourself.

Chariotoflove > ttyymmnn
02/11/2020 at 15:53

4 years now and 35k miles. I’m just glad they’re covering most of it at this point rather than sending me away again telling me it’s fine.

ttyymmnn > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 15:55

Yeah, seems like a fair deal to me.

HammerheadFistpunch > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 15:55

I would ask what specifically they injector service is, if they say anything that isn’t a physical service, pass. I.e. “we use a detergent to clean the injectors.”

Thats $145 of worthless

Chariotoflove > HammerheadFistpunch
02/11/2020 at 15:57

That’s what they do

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 15:57

That’s bull shit. I’d go to napa/autozone etc and buy my own battery.

Injector and coolant flush at 35k? T hat’s a 60k service usually.

HammerheadFistpunch > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 15:58

first, its literally just a bottle of detergent you can buy anywhere. second, if you are using good gas you don’t need it.

smobgirl > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 15:58

Hah. Dealer here swore up and down I had a bad battery (which conveniently cost $100 more from them) when mine just wasn’t installed correctly after new coil packs (loose connection). I don’t trust their battery analysis at all anymore.

Chariotoflove > HammerheadFistpunch
02/11/2020 at 16:00

I just caught him and told him not to do it. Hopefully they haven’t started already

HammerheadFistpunch > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 16:01

hope so. Thats $145 you can use elsewhere.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 16:01

I’ve misplaced my thinking cap. All I can find is this sombrero...

Kinja'd!!!

Anyway... when I see “I’ve taken it into the dealer, but they can’t find anything wrong.”, it reminds me of a time when I took my car to a dealer, they did a half-assed diagnosis, replaced a part that DIDN’T fix the problem, told me “my car is ready” even though the problem wasn’t fixed, gave the service adviser an earful and told them to do the diagnosis I paid for rather than a half-assed code read.

So from what I understand, you have to narrow down *where* the leak is coming from. And one way to do that is to start pulling fuses and checking for current draw using a mulitmeter:

And once you have it narrowed down to a specific fuse/circuit, then you look at what is on that fuse/circuit and go from there as demonstrated in the video.

Also, if the battery is 5 years old or older, just replace it as a starting point.

Chariotoflove > HammerheadFistpunch
02/11/2020 at 16:02

Too late. I got suckered.

GoodIdeaAtTheTime > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 16:03

Coolant at 35K? Weird. What year is it? We change our coolant at 120k (Infiniti) , unless it has a leak or low specific gravity, like if you top it off with straight water. Check your owner’s manual, service intervals will be in there, unless it is missing.

GoodIdeaAtTheTime > benjrblant
02/11/2020 at 16:04

We recommend ours at 30K for direct injected engines. 90K for older fuel injection. DI engines carbon up, quick.

Chariotoflove > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever
02/11/2020 at 16:05

Well I got suckered I’m by the recommendation. I tried to go say not right now, but he’s already started on it. I believe him that the factory recommends it. That’s different from if the engine needs it. I should have told him no until I could research it.

Chariotoflove > smobgirl
02/11/2020 at 16:06

Well I’m glad to just have it done at this point for $20 bucks.

Chariotoflove > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly
02/11/2020 at 16:07

I’m replacing it. If this problem comes up later I’ll be diagnosing it on my own.

Chariotoflove > GoodIdeaAtTheTime
02/11/2020 at 16:08

2015. I should have just passed in it this time. But they jumped on my okay and started before I could stop them.

HammerheadFistpunch > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 16:12

see if you can negotiate the price down? Tell them you don’t want to pay labor on it, given that its just opening up the gas cap.

Chariotoflove > HammerheadFistpunch
02/11/2020 at 16:16

He offered me 10% off for my trouble.

I feel kinda stupid like I should have known better and held off in spontaneous service additions. He got me with the “factory recommended” thing. You can take me Oppo Gold Card now.

HammerheadFistpunch > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 16:17

Hey man it happens, I just paid $50 for what I assumed was a special product and when I got it realized its a foot of hydraulic hose.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 16:17

Offf I hate it whe n that happens.

I did pay >$100 for a radiator cap once... thought is was something worse tho.

Chariotoflove > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever
02/11/2020 at 16:20

Well I should probably be on Oppositelock probationary status for a while. Need to remember to pay attention. I’ve dodged a lot of upsells in the past, but I got lazy.

Chariotoflove > HammerheadFistpunch
02/11/2020 at 16:23

Ugh. I have to guard against counting up all the times I’ve thrown away little bits of money here and there. They add up too fast and make me depressed.

I’m just going to focus on getting a new battery. If I get this problem anymore, Incan hang it in them and get it fixed in their dime.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 16:29

I was going to suggest probation and some remedial training. Sounds like it’s time.

Chariotoflove > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever
02/11/2020 at 16:39

Hopefully I can serve it on weekends so I don’t have to claim work time.

benjrblant > GoodIdeaAtTheTime
02/11/2020 at 16:51

that’s surprising. I’ve never had a DI engine.

LimitedTimeOnly @ opposite-lock.com > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 16:58

Yes, none of us would ever want Oppo to interfere with work time. *eye roll*

Chariotoflove > LimitedTimeOnly @ opposite-lock.com
02/11/2020 at 17:28

The star I just gave you should in no way be construed as condoning the subversive tone of your comment.

Chariotoflove > smobgirl
02/11/2020 at 17:41

Addendum: I don’t trust them fully either. But, they have been sending us away for a while telling me the battery is fine. Getting them to replace it under warranty now is a victory because if the problem recurs, then they are on the hook for it. That’s how things ended up with my Mazda. New battery with 2 year warranty, show up with bad battery within 18 months, get new free battery. Lather rinse repeat. Of course you know it wasn’t the battery. Knowing this car it was probably the coils. But I didn’t know enough to tell them what to do or fix it myself, and they couldn’t fine a cause

How did the muffins turn out?

smobgirl > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 19:27

For sure, under warranty is the best option! I took mine back to Advance because the battery was still warrantied. They tested it, saw it was good, replaced it anyway in case there was a faulty cell, and then realized the actual problem. Takes a hammer to install my battery, apparently!

Kinja'd!!!

Muffins are perfect. I made two baby bundt cakes with the rest of the batter and those are fine but slightly burnt on top (bottom?)

Chariotoflove > smobgirl
02/11/2020 at 20:13

Ice cream hides little imperfections like that. Just sayin.

We have a store here called Nothing Bundt Cakes. They sell all these flavors of cakes in tiny, medium, and large sizes. And they always have samples out. You just reminded me it’s been too long since I swung by there. It’s right next to a Starbucks, too.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 22:04

Look at it this way: You’re lucky to walk out of a dealer spending that little money.

Chariotoflove > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo
02/11/2020 at 22:07

B ut...I didn’t.

Chariotoflove > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo
02/11/2020 at 23:28

Please forgive me my perverse humor. When I see an opening I can’t help it. Especially after a couple of margaritas.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > Chariotoflove
02/11/2020 at 23:31

I didn't even get what you meant until I read this one. Now I feel awful though I know I ought not to because you know what I was going for there ahhhhhhhhh!

Chariotoflove > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo
02/12/2020 at 00:18

Just roll with it.